Realm spell update

[X-MOC/Leman States (Even)]

Like you need to do anything else to make Even more annoying.

Hey, don't belittle my job of being annoying.

On a more serious note, getting twice the RP payment back is a huge boost. Compared to many of the structures in the game it would be a huge long term boon

[X-ETN/Maire Cwyllmie (Libor)]

Caster level: Divine 7

Does it mean that lvl 7 cleric can cast it? Or is it a lvl 7 spell (lvl 13 cleric required)?

[X-MOC/Leman States (Even)]

Caster level: Divine 7

Does it mean that lvl 7 cleric can cast it? Or is it a lvl 7 spell (lvl 13 cleric required)?

It's as per normal spell descriptions, so a level 7 spell.

[X-IHH/Wallac Isilviere (Kasper)]

DM Notes: Example of a fun, if not always very useful spell...actually you can get back twice the RP you used to cast the spell, but it will take a while. But the main thing is the coolness factor; what domain can resist having a patron saint 

The coolness factor is what makes this spell great. The number of RP is nice but getting to research a level 7 spell and cast it wasm I assume, not free

[X-Tornilen/SM (Alexander)]

There is a new type of duration - Sustained. As I understand it, spells with that duration can be sustained indefinitely as long as the cost is paid.

Will Protection from Realm Magic be one of the new spells with Sustained duration? As it is now it's  hard for a low-level caster to maintain magical protection as he/she would have to cast the spell quite often. Is this going to change?

The same goes for similar spells, such as Ward Against Scrying.

[DM B]

There is a new type of duration - Sustained. As I understand it, spells with that duration can be sustained indefinitely as long as the cost is paid.

Will Protection from Realm Magic be one of the new spells with Sustained duration? As it is now it's  hard for a low-level caster to maintain magical protection as he/she would have to cast the spell quite often. Is this going to change?

The same goes for similar spells, such as Ward Against Scrying.

Sustained only means that if the source/temple powering the spell is disrupted, the spell immediately ends. As opposed to timed spells that just last their duration once cast (unless dispelled) - such as the various buff spells.

A few additional spells now have a duration of 1 year (1 month/level)

[X-Tornilen/SM (Alexander)]

Ah ok, my mistake then.

[DM B]

Gods this is boring...I'm well 'over the top' now, and that is VERY comforting. The more I work with the spell, the more lacking I find many of them to be, so I'll probably will have to look through all of them once more...and of course they need playtesting.

Not all the spells will be super-powerful; that is not the intention. Magic is different and can also be a powerful enhancer for other aspects of the domain rules, but a wizard isn't inherently more powrful than a fighter regent/mundane domain. If you're looking for that, you've come to the wrong place.

Spell seem to fall into three groups; spells that affect provinces in various ways, spells that are effective during wars but have long durations and are best cast BETWEEN battles, and spells that are actually of use on the field of battle.

[X-MOC/Leman States (Even)]

This might become abundantly clear once the revised spell descriptions are released, but aallow me to ruminate.

Spells fall into rough categories as outlined by Bjorn, and generally become more powerful through two separate mechanisms; increased spell level or increased caster level.

As the caster level increases, the effect of the spells generally don't become more powerfull, but cover a larger area or have a longer duration. This increase typically has a corresponding increase in RP cost. The only saving is in the GB and Action component of preparing the spells. This allows higher level casters to be more 'efficient' with their actions and less dependent on courts for mass preparations, but the overall power level is sptill constrained by RP availability.

As spell levels increase it becomes less clear. Spells generally become more powerfull, but there is an increase in GB and/or RP cost. E.g. for spells that fall into the category 'zap unit on battlefield', is it intended that they become more effective per RP for the higher level spells? Or should the effect per RP remain relatively constant, and there again only being a slight efficiency gain in the number of actions required to acheive the desired effect?

Perhaps a way towards balancing the spells, other than lengthy playtesting, would be to consider a table of approximate effect per RP for various effects such as hits to unit, stat bonus to unit and prosperity bonus to province. Might be hard to set a fixed number to all things, and these are only some of the possible effects out there, but could be a good ballpark to work with for future spell creation as well.

[X-MOC/Leman States (Even)]

I'm working my way through ALL the realm spell; I've just finished Celestial Siege Train.

There are many changes large and small.

Now is a good time to come up with suggestion as to what spells need fixing (and not).

One example of a spell that has always bothered me is Ward Against Realm Scrying. This relies somewhat on a character level Scry check, which is not really that appropriate. It also doesn't tie in that closely with Realm Scrying as well. Perhaps a more suitable effect would be to simply increase the DCC of any Scrying spells.

Could there perhaps also be a spell out there that obfuscates the affairs of the court, and increases the DCC of a regular Espionage attempt? There must surely be something in any respected wizards aresenal to prevent an assassin from stumbling upon them in the dark.

[DM B]

That is one spell that is being altered; since the Scry spell now enables an Espionage action, the Ward spell must do...something other than it does now

[DM B]

As the caster level increases, the effect of the spells generally don't become more powerfull, but cover a larger area or have a longer duration. This increase typically has a corresponding increase in RP cost. The only saving is in the GB and Action component of preparing the spells. This allows higher level casters to be more 'efficient' with their actions and less dependent on courts for mass preparations, but the overall power level is sptill constrained by RP availability.

Duration is generally fixed in the PbeM, since a duriation of 1 week/lvl translates to 1 domain turn...regardless of your caster level. Number of affected targets DO vary with level, following a 1/1, 1/2 or 1/3 ratio (some spells have only a single target regardless of caster level). Some spells also have other level-dependent benefits.

So higher-level casters DO have an advantage, but it is intentionally one that relates primarily to 'action efficiency' (i.e. for the prepare time/cost of a single spell you can hit more targets) but offers no benefit in terms of RP used.

[DM B]

As spell levels increase it becomes less clear. Spells generally become more powerfull, but there is an increase in GB and/or RP cost. E.g. for spells that fall into the category 'zap unit on battlefield', is it intended that they become more effective per RP for the higher level spells? Or should the effect per RP remain relatively constant, and there again only being a slight efficiency gain in the number of actions required to acheive the desired effect?

There will be a greater differentiation between spell levels now;

- a 1st lvl zap spell might cause 1 hit on a failed save/successful attack roll (and would have a cap on number of targets affected/damage dice dealt, just as personal spells do).
- a 5th lvl zap spell would do more damage and could potentially hit more targets
- a 9th lvl sap spell would just kill the target unit on a failed save, and still do heavy damage on a successful save.

The actual rate of RP to damage potential would remain relatively constant; but with a slight advantage to higher level spells (at least as per this posting - more testing is needed).

[X-MOC/Leman States (Even)]

Any update on the realm spells? I was looking at Crusade and Holy War, and found that neither was of great benefit. Especially Holy War has a very limited use due to the 4GB cost of preparing the spell. Assuming it is cast on something like 8 Armsmen, the saving will only be 8GB, against a cost of 4 GB, 16 RP and 1 Regent Action. While there is potential for some more savings if used on even higher cost units, it is not too frequent there are 8 units of knights gathered. If used on fewer units, the benefit becomes even less.

Edit: One thing that would make the spell slightly more versatile would be if it could be cast on units in more than one Province. This would make it much more likely that the spell could benefit a sufficient number of units for it to be economical.

[X-MOC/Leman States (Even)]

Alternatively the spell could have it's duration increased. E.g. 2 turns, and a higher level spell could have 4 turns.